Hey, Budtender!
7/31/14 - We discuss weekend trips to the wine country and geodesic greenhouses (dude! Bio-Dome!), Kanye’s struggle against the creative class system, plug-and-play celebrity fragrances, how to contact your professional crush, and another genius trend story from the New York Times: wedding weed concierges.
Transcript below.
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CREDITS
Producer: Gina Delvac
Hosts: Aminatou Sow & Ann Friedman
Theme song: Call Your Girlfriend by Robyn
TRANSCRIPT: HEY, BUDTENDER!
Ann: Welcome to Call Your Girlfriend.
Aminatou: A podcast for long-distance besties everywhere.
Ann: Everywhere. I'm Ann Friedman.
Aminatou: And I'm Aminatou Sow. Today on the agenda we're going to be discussing Kanye West's GQ cover story, Beyonce fragrances, what happens when women in minorities try to promote diversity at work, marijuana at weddings.
Ann: Ooh.
Aminatou: And maybe we'll have -- I know, right? And maybe we'll have time for one or two questions from our audience. From our listeners.
Ann: Oh my god, we have an audience.
Aminatou: I know. I was just like readers, audience, I don't know what I'm talking about. Welcome to the podcast.
Ann: We are still very much very long-distance. I am in London. I'm kind of sick. Can you hear the cough drop knocking my teeth? It's like [Gnawing sound].
Aminatou: Oh my god, that's disgusting. [Laughs]
Ann: I know, it's really gross. I am in London and it's very early in the morning and you are in California and it's very late at night.
Aminatou: Yeah, I'm in San Francisco Ann. It's like midnight on Monday. Almost like I don't have important things to do in the morning.
Ann: I mean it is my morning and this is my important thing. Aww.
Aminatou: Aww, you're the best part of my day!
Ann: That was supposed to be your reaction. [Laughs] I know! I just awwed.
[Theme Song]
(2:06)
Ann: Well I was going to say that we're both kind of sick so disclaimer we both sound a little froggy I think.
Aminatou: I sound like this all the time so I don't think I can claim sickness. I just sound like a . . .
Ann: Didn't you tell me you were sick?
Aminatou: No, I just said that I usually sound like you sound when you're sick. [Laughter]
Ann: Okay, yeah. We both did little weekend trips. Tell me about yours.
Aminatou: My little weekend trip was really fun. I went today. I spent all day in wine country. I got very drunk. [Laughs] And now I'm here talking to you so we'll see. We'll see how it goes.
Ann: I feel weird about wine country. Like in some ways I would just prefer to buy a full bottle of wine and not have to pretend to know anything about how things taste different on my palate. I'm made supremely nervous by the act of paying for something and the person at the winery knows I don't know shit about wine and I'm just here to drink and we're engaging in this whole charade like I might buy a case and I would rather just drink and make clear that I'm drinking this bottle.
Aminatou: Okay, so this was nothing like that. Basically what happened is that I went with these new friends, LOL, new friends, to like somebody's dad's sister's wife's winery thing. Unclear. All I know is there was a lot of wine and very little food.
Ann: So you had a great time?
Aminatou: Yeah, I had a great time. I barely talked to anybody I didn't want to talk to. Nobody was like "Tell me about this wine's legs" or whatever. It was delightful.
(3:50)
Ann: [Laughs] Just say everything's oaky. My dear friend Erin Bernstein once advised me to say "Oh, it's a little on the oaky side" any time you don't have anything to say.
Aminatou: Oh, whenever I'm in a mood around wine people I always say "Oh, this would taste so great with some Sprite in it" and they get so angry. [Laughter]
Ann: I'm going to file that one away.
Aminatou: But it's true! Sprite makes everything into a spritzer.
Ann: Oh my god, for a sponsor, Sprite.
Aminatou: Yeah, so what did you do this weekend Ann?
Ann: Oh man, I went to Cornwall which is basically the Cape Cod of England. It's like the OG Cape Cod.
Aminatou: LOL.
Ann: I know. Everything has the same names as the towns in Cape Cod only it's like the original version. It makes you realize how little imagination the puritans had. They're like "We miss Falmouth. Let's just name something else Falmouth. We miss Truro. New Truro."
Aminatou: [Laughs]
Ann: Not even New Truro. Just Truro again. I mean I was like I get that you guys didn't really want to leave home, but oof, come up with some new town names.
Aminatou: Oh my god, you're so ridiculous. So what you're telling me is you had a delightful weekend but in your Ann way you have to downplay it?
Ann: Okay, I had very much a delightful weekend. It is beautiful. I ate lots of snacks. Cornwall is famous for several different food items. You know I love regional delicacies.
Aminatou: Ooh, like what?
Ann: The cornish pasty which I want to pronounce as pastie every time I see it. It is not small discs to cover sex workers' nipples. It is . . .
Aminatou: I can't even with you right now.
Ann: It is as with all things in England some kind of dough with meat in the middle or if you don't eat meat cheese or onion.
Aminatou: Wait are you eating meat over there without me?
Ann: No girl. You can get a cheese and onion version.
Aminatou: Okay. You know I like to be the only person that feeds you meat so this is touchy.
(5:50)
Ann: I won't lie I have slipped a few times but . . .
Aminatou: No, it's fine. It's fine. It's like what are you going to do? When in Rome.
Ann: It's true, Rome has a lot of meat pies in it in this analogy. [Laughter] One of the friends who was on this trip is from Wales and we were all enjoying our pastys and he was like god, is there just anything better than meat with pastry wrapped around it? Isn't that just like the best thing you can imagine? And I was like no. [Laughs] No it is not.
Aminatou: As you enjoy meat wrapped in dough. I can't even handle it right now. It's cool.
Ann: I mean it was tasty but like, you know, I don't know. I just like vegetables. You know me.
Aminatou: Ann, everybody likes vegetables. It's just also okay to like meat.
Ann: No, no, no. But I mean all of these pasty things are like . . . well not all vegetables but are suspiciously absent vegetables that aren't potatoes.
Aminatou: Ugh, says the woman who loves bacon. I can't even handle your hypocrisy right now.
Ann: Okay, we're going to table the convo about my meat consumption. [Laughs] And the other thing . . .
Aminatou: Yes. We'll have a special vegetarians and bacon episode coming soon.
Ann: Oh my god.
Aminatou: If there are any sponsors out there who want to talk to us about this please email us.
Ann: There was actually a menu at a restaurant I was at recently that featured the bad vegetarian sandwich which was all veg with bacon and I thought of you.
Aminatou: Amazing.
Ann: But anyway the other thing we did on this trip was we went to this massive bio dome. Sorry, biome. I'm calling it bio dome. because of Pauly Shore. None of the . . .
Aminatou: [Laughs]
Ann: None of the friends who are on this trip -- well that's not true, one of them was familiar with Bio dome. And I haven't seen it recently enough to make jokes. But anyway we went to this big biome, big geodesic greenhouses in the middle of nowhere called The Eden Project. And it was super weird. It was basically like Whole Foods turned into a museum. Like everything was about -- was for kids and was about consuming food and you had opportunities to buy things at every corner. It wasn't like it was run by scientists. I was like oh, this is run by people who are selling me an idea of organic food or something. But it was really cool to be in giant geodesic greenhouses. So that was my weekend.
(8:15)
Aminatou: That's awesome. I'm very happy for you. It featured all the things that you like.
Ann: Food, rocky cliffs.
Aminatou: Geodesic domes.
Ann: Geodesic domes. [Laughs]
Aminatou: And people from Wales.
Ann: All my favorite things. And meat pies.
Aminatou: Love a good meat pie.
[Clip Starts]
Male: I guess this means we're our own tour guides. All right, now everybody do not feed the animals, stay together, and no flash photography. And remember here at Bio dome. we're dependent on balancing homos within the system.
[Clip Ends]
Ann: Oh man, should we get to the agenda?
Aminatou: Yeah, let's get to the agenda. So talk to me. I'm so happy that you read this Kanye cover story. You know that Kanye is my favorite anything in the entire world. He's the only person/concept I will never be reasonable about and I guess for a long time I just felt like you never shared my Kanye enthusiasm to 100 so I was really excited when you wanted to talk about this.
Ann: I mean I think it would be wrong to say I share your Kanye enthusiasm to 100 but this GQ cover story is the most hilarious interview. Like it's just the . . . it's full of that stuff that you always want people to say when you interview them. I know I sent you a complete list after I read it and I'm going back over it now and it's pretty incredible, the quotes. Like he actually says -- he clarifies that in his wedding toast it wasn't all about him; it was about celebrities being treated like blacks were in the '60s.
Aminatou: [Laughs]
Ann: Can you defend that?
(9:50)
Aminatou: Listen, I don't have to defend Kanye. Kanye's going to Kanye. I think that -- so the reason I was excited about this interview is because it was the first interview since the wedding. But to be fair Kanye's been kind of on a tear with the quotes since this Zane Lowe BBC interview he did last year.
[Clip Starts]
Kanye: Well I've reached a point in my life where my Truman Show boat has hit the painting and I've got to a point that Michael Jackson did not break down. I have reached the glass ceiling as a creative person, as a celebrity. When I say that it means I want to do product. I am a product person. Not just clothing but water bottle design, architecture, everything, you know, that you could think about. And I've been at it for ten years and I look around and say wait a second, there's no one around here in this space that looks like me and if there are they're quiet as fuck. So that means wait a second, now we're seriously in a civil rights movement.
[Clip Ends]
Aminatou: He's not crazy, he's just gifted. So everybody's going to have to get onboard. But my actual favorite thing about this whole piece in GQ wasn't the interview but was the clothes because apparently all of them were his.
Ann: Oh my god.
Aminatou: He didn't need the celebrity wardrobe so that made me really happy. Can you just imagine like Patrick Demarchelier coming in to shoot and he's like "Excuse me, I own all of these." And he's wearing my favorite Adidas so everything is perfect.
Ann: I was going to say I know that you know which sneakers he owns and which he doesn't.
Aminatou: Yeah, no, I just ordered these Adidas because I have no loyalty to sneaker companies. I don't care. You make one I like, I will wear it. So Adidas I'm all yours now for the next couple weeks at least.
Ann: I mean so many endorsement possibilities coming up this episode.
Aminatou: [Laughs] You know, it's because I live in California now. The possibilities for endorsements are just endless.
Ann: Oh my god. You just said "Adidas, I'm all yours now" and I was just like mm-hmm, show us that money.
(12:00)
Aminatou: Mm-hmm. Yeah, the Adidas fuck you money. Can't wait.
Ann: Right. Wrapped in lots of other kind of ridiculous things that he says he uses this phrase "the class system of creativity" which is like certain people are sort of more culturally renowned or whatever. But I think it's actually kind of an interesting idea and I want someone -- it doesn't have to be Kanye but it could be -- to explore that at length.
Aminatou: Yeah, I mean that's kind of what his whole gripe about the world he's in is about, right? And I think that more specifically he's talking about the fashion world and how he just hasn't been embraced there. You know, he's done all of these internships for everyone and all he wants is that big endorsement money for someone to just give him a chance so he can be, or DONDA can be this big fashion house and it's not happening. Some of it I don't understand because the hashtag Kanye but some of it I think is very true. Like Kanye went to art school and this is like the one I think part of his career that he feels like he has to work at really hard, right, is fashion because it doesn't come naturally to him like music or design or all the other stuff that he does and he feels like he's not getting any respect for it.
Ann: I mean there is a part of me listening to you describe all of that that makes me think Kanye is like the Ivy League kid who gets tons and tons of internships and is just not good at that thing that they're trying to make happen but because they have this resume of all these internships they could afford to do they're like "I'm so qualified, why won't anyone hire me?" It's like maybe Kanye is just good at music and that's okay.
Aminatou: [Gasps] But Ann, that's the thing that people who are creative never want to hear, right? That they're only good at this one thing. Ugh, this is so hard to parse. I think I kind of agree with him up to a certain point because it's like he's put in the time and the effort, right? And there was a time where at least people in the fashion industry mocked him and thought he was not serious. It's like every celebrity wants to branch out into doing a shoe or doing a perfume or things that we'll talk about later. But sometimes you are good and people just won't give you a chance because they don't take you seriously.
(14:20)
Ann: Yeah, but I think there are -- look, there are . . . I think there are other people who have become embraced by the fashion world who are not from that world in a traditional sense. Maybe it is this class system of creativity. I mean I don't know enough about, you know, whatever is going on in Anna Wintour's head or whoever else is an important taste maker to say. But all I'm saying is we need to leave room for the possibility that Kanye is bad at fashion. That's it.
Aminatou: Oh my god, I refuse to leave room for the possibility of that. But I want to give a shout-out to Anna Wintour who put him on the cover of Vogue and put Kim on the cover of Vogue. Granted the hashtag for it was ridiculous but that is what he has been looking for his entire life so that was good validation for him. I'm happy for you Kanye.
Ann: I mean I love that he mentioned in the GQ interview, he was like "What more do I have to do? I was on the cover of Vogue." And it's like well . . .
Aminatou: [Laughs]
Ann: I kind of wanted to pat his knee.
Aminatou: Ann, Kanye is not a reasonable person. I think that that's the problem with your whole argument, you're operating from a place of reason. Stop it.
[Music]
(15:52)
Ann: Yeah, are we done with Kanye? Are we ready to move? I mean we're never done with . . .
Aminatou: Yeah, we're done with Kanye but you sent me this thing about Beyonce fragrances, and tell me more. What is going on?
Ann: So I was perusing Beyoncé's website as you do.
Aminatou: Shop.beyonce.com.
Ann: I mean yes, which I had visited before, but there's like a fragrances section and when I clicked on it I was like oh my god, stealth. She seriously has like five different fragrances that she has attached her name to.
Aminatou: Yeah, I don't know where you've been. Beyoncé's had fragrances for a while. You have to watch the commercial for Heat because it'll just blow your mind with LOLs, they're so ridiculous.
Ann: Maybe we should pause and listen to the commercial for Heat. Maybe Gina can find it.
[Clip Plays]
Aminatou: Yeah, no. I mean and she was part of that whole trend in the aughts where every lady celebrity had a perfume. The Britney Spears ones are my favorite because the ads are just even more ridiculous.
Ann: Oh my god.
Aminatou: But I will rank Beyonce fragrances for you. Pulse and Rise are just garbage. Don't invest. World Tour is a little too fruity, and Heat, you can get away with a hint of Heat but still garbage.
Ann: Do you own Beyonce fragrances?
Aminatou: Obviously not. I'm a classy lady; I own classy perfumes. But every once in a while I'm at Sephora and I will peruse. You know what I do own though is some Justin Bieber fragrances and I don't regret them.
Ann: Wow. I'm . . .
(17:55)
Aminatou: Taylor Swift also makes good fragrances.
Ann: Like all of these people have multiple fragrances.
Aminatou: Yeah, because that's how you start. You do like Heat and then they're like "Beyonce, what about Pulse? Beyonce, what about . . ." Basically a lot of times they'll coincide with world tours or whatever merchandise garbage they have to do. And I don't think that adult women are buying these but I can see a lot of 12-year-olds wearing these.
Ann: I just -- it's funny, it must be the most lucrative thing you can do because I'm sort of like what about the Beyonce hosiery line? Why does everyone have to branch out into fragrances? What about things I care about?
Aminatou: Merchandising is basically a big scam. J. Lo used to make my favorite fragrances.
Ann: Oh my god. Wait, J. Lo no longer making fragrances?
Aminatou: You know, maybe she does. I just haven't been on Team J. Lo for a while.
Ann: Does Kanye have fragrances? He must.
Aminatou: No, he doesn't but maybe he should look into it. Yeah, no, let me read some of the J. Lo fragrances to you.
Ann: Please.
Aminatou: Blue Glow, Deseo, Deseo For Men, Deseo Forever, Eau de Glow, Forever Glowing, Glow, Glow After Dark. [Laughs] What is wrong with these people? But yeah, celebrities all have perfumes though. I feel like that's par of the course if you're any kind of C, B, or A-lister.
Ann: Oh my god. It's funny, it's like a no-go zone for the A-list to have a fragrance.
Aminatou: Yeah, you know, the problem is they all smell bad. They just all smell bad. It's like if your perfume was good Guerlain would make it, not Miami Glow.
Ann: I'm going to do some research. There has to be an article about . . . I'm going to report back next episode about sort of the business of making celebrity fragrances. Because there's got to be like one company or something that does a plug-and-play version.
(20:00)
Aminatou: Yeah, no, it totally has to be one company because they always go through big retailers. I feel like a lot of these end up at Kohl's for example. And I think too you know how they always want to do fashion lines and then you're like uh, fashion's hard? But fragrance, how easy can it be to make a fragrance? I guarantee it's pretty easy.
Ann: Make a smell. Yeah.
Aminatou: Yeah, it's like plug-and-play smells.
[Music and Ads]
(22:12)
Ann: Let's talk about something serious. There was this article about when women in minorities try to promote or be a friend to other women in minorities at work it does not go well for them.
Aminatou: Yeah, you know, this is crazy. So this study by I think it was the University of Colorado, Boulder, almost went to college there, what's up Boulder, they asked bosses and all these executives to rate the executives on their warmth and competence, overall performance, and I'm doing big quotes, like scare quotes here, "diversity valuing behavior."
Ann: Oh my god, what is that?
Aminatou: And they discover it's not shocking. Basically diversity within companies is only seen as a positive attribute for the company and the boss if the boss is a white man. Like uh, shocker.
Ann: Wow.
Aminatou: The thing about it that I think is most problematic, right, is the people generally within companies who will speak up for this kind of diversity tend to be women and people of color and now it is documented that there is no reward for them unless a white man does it. I would be happy for a white man to lead all the diversity initiatives within workplaces.
Ann: But so many of these studies, is this surprising to any woman or any person of color who's been the one person at the table saying "Oh, look at this stack of applications. Maybe we should try a little harder to get some applicants who aren't white guys." Like anyone who's been in that room and everyone's always like "Oh, already we have so many to sort through." Or like "Ugh, well this is a really tough position to fill. You know, we've got enough great candidates here." You know what I mean? Just hearing the sort of casual like we don't actually need to do more diversity outreach or whatever. It's just sort of like that's not a helpful comment in this process and something that I've been hit with before for sure.
(24:12)
Aminatou: I know. But you know the thing that was a little scary to me is then it has these management implications for you. Like I'm always that person, right, because I kind of have to be but also because I basically lead a group for women in technology so it's very like duh Aficionado magazine for me. But I never realized that -- I mean I get it that it turns people off but seeing it documented that it could also adversely affect my career, that's something that was shocking.
Ann: Yeah. I mean I'm glad that there are studies. I'm always glad that there are studies. I remember you sending me the obituary for one of the two sociologists who did a lot of these original workplace bias studies.
Aminatou: Ugh, we love obituaries in this family.
Ann: We really do. Maybe that should be a thing we do regularly, like an obit of the week because they are fascinating and I always read them. But just this idea that it's all in your head, or even this story, it's not surprising to anyone who's been the person at the table to say "Oh hey, maybe we should think about promoting someone who isn't white," you know, to hear this news. But to hear it backed up with statistics, or to sort of say "Oh, the University of Colorado or some other accredited university affirms my experience" is actually important. I know it's kind of like, you know, we're both like yeah, we get it. But it's . . . I don't know. I guess it's good to have outside confirmation. I don't know how we change it though.
(25:50)
Aminatou: I mean that's the whole point, right? You and I can't change it; the bosses have to change it, because that's where the actual barrier is.
Ann: The top?
Aminatou: I know, everything's at the top. Ugh, I'm so over bosses. Everything is just the worst.
Ann: I mean you are a boss now. I'm not a boss, but . . .
Aminatou: No, I am not a boss.
Ann: You aren't?
Aminatou: That's the best. No, that was the best thing about taking my new job is I get to not be a boss and I kind of love it.
Ann: Oh, being a boss is lots and lots of work.
Aminatou: Yeah. Now I'm just like I get to be one of those complainers. I love it.
Ann: Yes. Both of us. All right, so I guess the other question is what can you do? Like with all of this in mind is there a way to continue to be that woman or that person of color who continues to bring up these issues again and again? Are you just supposed to be either silent and not speak up for something you believe in or a martyr who never gets promoted because you do speak up? It seems like those are the choices offered.
Aminatou: Right, I think that . . . man, this is really tough. I think that it obviously depends where you work, but if you work at a real . . . so if you're not a journalist because I'm convinced journalism is the least professional anything in the world, like don't work in journalism. But if you work at a real office with a real HR and actual structures to change things I think it basically makes you realize there are other structures for you to take these problems to, right? So if you don't feel comfortable being the person in your meetings that's always the one bringing this up, maybe it's going through your HR structure and bringing up these kinds of challenges and saying "What are we as a company doing to change this?" as opposed to "What is my boss doing to change this or these particular people?" So not making it personal; making it more systematic.
Ann: Yeah, I also feel like . . .
(27:50)
Aminatou: I'm saying that and it sounds like garbage to me so really I think you should just burn everything down.
Ann: I mean I was just going to say the kind of find a bro ally approach has worked for me in the past too. I mean I think it's, when we talk about this stuff, it always seems like women and people of color are the only people who care about this stuff and it's disproportionately true it's us but not exclusively. And sometimes being like oh, I need my pal who is not a woman or not a person of color to be the one to really say no, we need to interview this other person we've been talking about . . .
Aminatou: I know, but you know what's disgusting about it is you're saying that that person gets to take credit for it so it's . . .
Ann: Yeah.
Aminatou: Either way how you slice it it's kind of problematic right?
Ann: No, no, for sure. That is definitely in the more be a martyr and don't get credit camp but still push forward the thing that you believe in.
Aminatou: Ugh, Ann, I don't share men, I don't share dessert, and I don't share credit. This is so bad.
Ann: [Laughs] I mean you have shared your dessert with me but point taken. Point taken. Okay, so we have no answers we've established.
Aminatou: Yeah, we have no answers. Basically we keep being depressed by corporate America. Corporate America get your crap together because I, ugh, can't handle.
Ann: We have a reader question. It is one we can answer and has to do with the workplace so I'm going to read it. This is a letter from listener Katie. "Since listening to Call Your Girlfriend I've read a lot of articles and learned about Shine Theory which is exciting." This is -- do you want to give the tag line, Amina?
Ann: Shine Theory, a.k.a. I don't shine if you don't shine, is the operating principle between me and Ann's friendship. Yeah, that's about it. You can read more about it on the Internet. [Laughs]
(29:45)
Ann: Yeah. And so she says "All of which has been encouraging for taking initiative in my own professional endeavors. Your advice for upcoming . . ." Upcoming. I love that she calls them upcoming female professionals. It's like coming soon to a theater near you, female professionals.
Aminatou: Coming to a theater near you, bad-ass female professionals.
Ann: So anyway, "Your advice for upcoming female professionals is to directly contact women they admire in industries they want to break into. I've got my list ready to go but I'm hesitating. What is the etiquette for emailing somebody you think is the coolest person in the world to ask for their advice?" Amina.
Aminatou: Oh man, this is so tough. I think that the most important thing in all of these kinds of interactions is to be yourself. I know that you think that the person on the other side of that email is the coolest person in the world, but dang it, you're the coolest person in the world too. Be very upfront about what you want. I think that the number one mistake people make when they need something via email to people they admire is they don't have a specific ask in mind and they ramble and then it just goes all sorts of bad. I'm not very good at writing these emails. I think, Ann, you're much better than I am.
Ann: Well one of the things that I noticed about this email is Shine Theory for example isn't about like -- and this is something that I think was misunderstood when I wrote about it the first time -- it's not about looking around you and saying "Who is the most important woman doing a thing I want to be doing and how do I make her my friend?" It's more like look around you in your world and rather than compete with the other awesome women who are kind of at your same stage, the other upcoming female professionals, sort of befriending them as well. Because I think you say women you admire or someone you think is the coolest person in the world, and obviously lots of my peers are people I admire and think are cool. But there's something about the tone of this email that makes me think maybe you're talking about people who are far more advanced in their careers.
And I think it's cool to email them, and I agree with Amina's advice that asking a specific question and being yourself is really the best you can do. And also being patient waiting for an answer. But I think that you should also take that as a call to sort of look around your office or your university or wherever you're at right now and be like okay, which of these women do I want to invest in early? [Laughs] Like before they get to that -- you know, maybe the phase where everyone is recognizing that they're the coolest person in the world. That's what I think is actually revolutionary and great about Shine Theory, not like trying to kiss up or befriend. Yeah, exactly, exactly. And she will be . . . then there's no sort of humble ask. She's like yes, I definitely want to have a drink. It's not like . . . they're kind of different things. And I think that yes, Shine Theory encompasses all of them because it's for people who want other people to be great but maybe apply it to people who aren't just far and away the coolest person in the world as far as you're concerned.
Aminatou: Yay! Good luck listener.
Ann: Yeah, that's a much better question to answer than how do you not get caught in workplace racism and sexism that we're powerless to change in the short term.
Aminatou: Yeah, don't worry, you're going to get caught in all of those. The question is how do you escape? [Laughs] Yeah, you're going to need like everybody you can . . .
Ann: This is why I love it when you say we tell people it's lonely at the top so they won't come up here.
Aminatou: [Laughs] Thank you for telling everybody that I'm a jerk but yes.
Ann: I mean all I'm saying is just get people up top with . . .
Aminatou: I hear you.
[Music]
(34:02)
Ann: What else is on the agenda? What's left?
Aminatou: So I also wanted to talk about this ridiculous New York Times trend story from this weekend. You know how I love a good New York Times trend story about how marijuana is now a welcome wedding guest at Colorado and Washington State weddings.
Ann: Oh my god, only Colorado and Washington State.
Aminatou: Because it's legalized. Yeah, no, obviously. And the whole article is so crazy I want to read it to you. I haven't laughed this hard at a trend story because you know the trends are always fake trends and this one is a really good fake trend.
Ann: Where does it rate on a scale of diaperless babies in Brooklyn? Is it better than that? That's my favorite New York Times story.
Aminatou: Man, I know, the diaperless babies in Brooklyn is the top. This is, hmm, I would say like two trends away from diaperless babies.
Ann: Great, hit me.
Aminatou: I'm just going to read the lead to you. "Earlier this month when Ellen Epstein arrived at the Devil's Thumb Ranch," hey, that's where Marisie got married. [Laughs] Never mind. And hi Marisie, who you're probably listening in Tabernash, Colorado. Never mind, that's not where she got married. "For the wedding of her friends, Lauren Measel and Bradley Something, she like the other guests found a gift bag waiting for her in her hotel room. But rather than a guide to activities in the area or a jar of locally-made honey," LOL, "the canvas bag contained a rolled joint, a lighter, and lip balm infused with mango butter and cannabis along with this note. 'We wanted to show you some of the things we love the best.'" [Laughs]
Ann: Oh my god. Very me with my infused cannabis lip balm.
(35:45)
Aminatou: Ann, yeah, there's nothing that the wedding industry won't ruin. So the rest of the trend story is about how guests are given baby marijuana plants and ceramic pots with their names and table assignments. Yeah, another ridiculous quote is "Marijuana use at weddings is out of the closet now." It's like get out. Then there are marijuana concierges that will basically work with your wedding planner to figure out what best weed you want at your wedding. Just there's nothing that the wedding industry won't ruin. This is just everything about it is ridiculous.
Ann: Are we going to have like some day to be like ugh, I remember when we had to duck behind the reception tend to get stoned at the wedding. Those were the days. [Laughs]
Aminatou: I know, like the only reasonable person in this entire article is one of the bakers who's like "I'm not making an edible cake because that stuff is garbage." And I'm like thank you sir, you're like the only professional adult here. But yeah, can you imagine going to a wedding with somebody's parents? You know I love to get stoned more than the next person. Call Your Girlfriend endorses marijuana. But I do not want to go to your marijuana concierge themed wedding.
Ann: Yeah, it's also so weird because it's at this point in acceptance where it's clearly not so stigmatized that it's making appearances in the New York Times style section but it's also stigmatized enough that people don't really know how to be good smokers. You know what I mean? It's not like one of those things where you're at a wedding and you're like oh, might as well just give it a try. You will have . . . you're like a freshman at your first kegger essentially. Like is that the experience you want?
Aminatou: Yeah, no, I don't want to get stoned with some of your parents.
Ann: Exactly.
Aminatou: I don't want to get stoned at rehearsal dinners. Some people are just awful whether they're stoned or sober.
Ann: Oh my god.
Aminatou: Oh, the other thing in the article is about the budtenders. So think like sommeliers but they work with cannabis instead of wine. Just ugh, I can't.
Ann: Wait, is this the first time you're hearing the word budtender?
(37:50)
Aminatou: Yeah, no, I didn't realize that this was like a weird thing.
Ann: Oh my god.
Aminatou: Obviously I knew that the function is real. I can't believe they have a name.
Ann: Yes.
Aminatou: And then also the budtonniere, so think boutonniere with weed, disgusting. I can't. I just can't handle . . . it's like big wedding meets big weed. I want prohibition to be back forever.
Ann: Wow. I mean listen, the results or the consequences of sort of making something like this legal is it's going to get commodified, you know what I mean, in disgusting ways like this. I'm sort of like let's hate the people who do this at their wedding; let's not hate the beautiful drug at the center of all of it. You know what I mean?
Aminatou: No, this is true. This is what I'm saying. Oh, the wedding industrial complex, just disgusting.
Ann: But also can you imagine . . .
Aminatou: All of this to say though that if I ever get married some people will be getting little tiny baby joints.
Ann: Right. I just keep thinking about the phenomenon of baby boomers who haven't been stoned since the '60s when you needed to smoke a ton as opposed to the golden era we're now living in where it's like one puff is probably the same as an entire joint from the ditch weed days and thinking about all of them in a tent together with infants in dresses and I just want to run screaming. Maybe this is where we sign off.
Aminatou: This is how we sign off. Where are you traveling to next?
Ann: I don't know. I don't have any plans. I have a couple of . . . like my last big deadlines of the summer are this week then I'm going to be really chill in August. That's my plan.
Aminatou: That's so awesome.
Ann: Yeah.
Aminatou: Well next time I talk to you I will either be in D.C or New York.
Ann: Oh my god, everywhere. We need to have like a geo tag for each episode, like where each of us are. Maybe we should do that. Anyways, I'll still be in London.
Aminatou: I know, kind of like a digital I've got hoes in different area codes.
Ann: I mean I've got the same hoe and she's always in different area codes. That's what's going on. [Laughter]
Aminatou: That's so true. Hey, I miss you a lot. I can't wait until we get back together.
Ann: Oh my god, so soon. Like a month until we're on the same coast.
Aminatou: So soon, so soon, so soon. Can't wait to show you around Silicon Valley.
Ann: Oh my god, arm candy.
Aminatou: I know all the best spots.
Ann: Yes. Let's fact-check it against Silicon Valley the HBO show which you know I love.
Aminatou: No, we're fact-checking against Dave Eggers' The Circle because my life right now is the first 100 pages. That's where I'm at.
Ann: Oh my god, don't make me worry about you more than I already am.
Aminatou: I mean you should be worried. I'm a software American now.
Ann: Ugh, okay.
Aminatou: I know. Aww! Okay. I love you, I love you. I'll see you on the Internet, boo.
Ann: See you on the Internet.
Aminatou: Thanks so much for listening to Call Your Girlfriend. You can find us many, many places online, mainly on iTunes where you can leave us a review, we would really appreciate that, or on Twitter at @callyrgf. That is @callyrgf. And you can also find us on our website callyourgirlfriend.com. Thanks so much for listening.